Sore Winner (complete)

[Armistice]

At long last, first complete tune of 2018. I have a cold at the moment and it's playing absolute havoc with my hears - everything sounds bassy and harsh - or maybe everything actually is bassy and harsh. Who knows... you tell me. In particular the last bit tracked, the vocals, I'm really not hearing well at all.

At a mere 2:14 this is way the shortest song I've ever done - you lot must be getting to me.

Anyway, as usual, any and all suggestions considered.

Sore Winner

Also, I actually got the idea from the Trump victory - the guy won and couldn't shut up about various aspects of the victory as we all recall I'm sure. But I decided to stay away from politics and turned it into a relationshippy tune instead.


Da lyrics:

Sore Winner

You have my head upon a stick
The game is yours, you’ve won the trick
You have defeated me for sure
Still…
Apparently it’s not enough
You moan on and huff and puff
Big bad wolf back at my door
You know…

Nobody likes a sore winner
Nobody likes a sore winner
Nobody likes a sore winner babe

Your every box has now been ticked
Your mortal enemy is licked
My humiliation’s done
It is...
But you’re wanting to complain
About the nature of my pain
Still you have to point the gun
You know...

Nobody likes a sore winner
Nobody likes a sore winner
Nobody likes a sore winner babe
Nobody likes a sore winner
You think you’re a boss but you’re just a beginner
Nobody likes a sore winner babe

And I contemplate defeat
I strategically retreat
Why must you go on?

[rayc]

COOL. The intro's starkness and riff reminded me of WPA's Shotgun Wedding.
I like the lyrics - contemporary without hanging on a moment in time.
The 2nd line - vocal starts a little low. That's all I can offer.
Nice one David - Enjoyed it!

[paulman]

I'm listening on my little bluetooth speaker, which has a pretty good bass thump, and your song does not sound too bassy. It sounds really good, thick and meaty. Maybe the vocal could sit a little higher, but everything else in the mix sounds spot on to me.

[JD01]

Listening on my reference cans:
Really like the guitar tone in the intro - nice to have a bit of grit in it!

The vocal isn't cutting through in places - I don't think its that its not loud enough, I think I can't hear it over the guitars.
There appears to be a weird noise or two in the backing vocal track, specifically at about 1:54. Its not loud enough for me to hear it and its just something there that I can just about hear.

Listening to it a couple more times, the vocal is popping out a bit more, I think that might just be 'cos I'm used it now though.

Its good though, mate. I like your music.

[Bubba]

Armi, I think the guitars are a little too loud and a little too thick -especially the first one. The mix is very close, it's just a tiny bit out of balance to me.

I feel that you've had to make the drums a little too bright in order to cut through, when a small drop in the guitar volumes and the mid/low mid density would allow plenty of room for the vocal and drums to cut through. Would you consider thinning the guitar mids slightly, dropping the guitars by a fraction of a dB and losing a bit of HF on the drum overheads?

I'd like to hear the vocal more particularly in the verses and I wouldnt worry about the BVs. I think they're great, although at 1:48 they conflict with the lead vocal with the words they sing. It doesn't help that the BV seems to be louder than the lead at that point. I think it's because the backing vocal gets punchier words to sing. How about singing the same words as the lead vocal, just at that spot? Bass guitar seems about right.

The song is really good, it's one of my favourites of yours that I've heard.

[musicturtle]

I like the tune. I really like your voice as well, but I do think you could bring it up some in the verses. I don't know if that would be with the level or a little more mid to low end EQ to give it some punch.

On first listen the guitars are a bit loud on the verse, maybe that's where the fix needs to be.

I agree with Bubba, could do with the BV singing the word "beginner" in unison with the lead. I really like that twist in the lyric and it's getting lost.

Still very nice work as a whole. Very cohesive sound, everything sounds like it belongs.

[SweetDan]

...
Also, I actually got the idea from the Trump victory - the guy won and couldn't shut up about various aspects of the victory as we all recall I'm sure. But I decided to stay away from politics and turned it into a relationshippy tune instead.
...

Cool! It sounds good, and I love lyrics where they're apparently about one thing, but their true meaning is something completely different.

In terms of critique, I'll echo the other responders in highlighting the lead vocal as still needing some love. I think it's more complex than just an EQ or level tweak, though.

What I'm hearing is an unevenness in the level of the vocal within phrases, sometimes even among syllables in words. The vocal is present and clear some of the time, and other times it drops quite a bit. The overall effect is to make the vocal less legible than it should be. Example phrases ("ALL CAPS" = it's loud and clear, "lower case" = that word, phrase or syllable gets lost in the mix):

- you have MY HEAD U-pon a stick
- BUT YOU'RE WANTING TO COM-plain
- AND I CONTEMPLATE DE-feat

Using/adding compression, or automation, or slicing up the waveform and boosting bits here and there - anything to level out the lead vocal - could do the trick. Then, go back and tweak EQ or add more overall level if needed. (And of course, all this should be balanced in conjunction with carving out space for the vocal from other tracks...)

[WhiskeyJack]

COOL!!!!

Off the bat i hear what JD is hearing with the vocals. I think they are where they need to be in the mix volume wise i just think they are a little too glassy. It needs a bump somewhere to fill in some sonic holes my ears like to hear in a vocal track. or maybe even a smidgen of saturation to taste? It almost feels like you carved something out of the vocal track to make room for something else?

When the guitars are by themselves in the beginning they sound fantastic. but when the drums kick in it seems like a really hard contrast. The guitars sound thick and burly all of a sudden and the drums are super shiny. And my novice ears can't tell if the guits are to loud and drums are eq'd around that to compensate or what? NOthing really sounds loud to me just the guit sounds chnage to my ears when everything comes together.

I do love the depth and space all your songs have man. It's freaking awesome. I love it.

[TheTestingYak]

gud choon. gives a durry m8?

[Armistice]

Thanks guys. Will not get a chance to tinker until Easter is over - probably - but will take feedback on board when I do, particularly that of TheTestingYak.

[Armistice]

Hokay - I had to duck back to my place today to get some stuff, so I spent a bit of time on the mix along the line of all your various suggestions (I hope!). I'm leaving the mismatched backing vocal at this stage as I kinda like it and I didn't have time to set up mics and sing it again anyway.

Anyone cares to give it another spin and let me know if I'm heading in the right direction, that would be tres awesome.

Cheers

[Bubba]

The balances are now much better, vocals are at the right level. I do think the highs on the vocals are a bit dulled, though. And I'd still like the drums to be a tad louder, but it's much improved.

The guitars sit much better in the full mix now, but to me the eq tweaks have left the intro guitar sound a bit boxy. It's lost something that the original had - warmth, I think. Could we have the intro sound back and automate the Eq for the main part of the song? Or put the intro on its own track with the original eq? I know the compression is a feature of the guitar sound but I find it a bit too noticeable. A taste thing?

[rayc]

David,
you left the lady friend to collect something and then did some remixing while you were there?
Brave lad.
Choruses - "a" has disappeared before "sore".
Sounds great.

[Armistice]

The balances are now much better, vocals are at the right level. I do think the highs on the vocals are a bit dulled, though. And I'd still like the drums to be a tad louder, but it's much improved.

The guitars sit much better in the full mix now, but to me the eq tweaks have left the intro guitar sound a bit boxy. It's lost something that the original had - warmth, I think. Could we have the intro sound back and automate the Eq for the main part of the song? Or put the intro on its own track with the original eq? I know the compression is a feature of the guitar sound but I find it a bit too noticeable. A taste thing?

It's still 1 April there isn't it?

Tomorrow night...

[Armistice]

David,
you left the lady friend to collect something and then did some remixing while you were there?
Brave lad.
Choruses - "a" has disappeared before "sore".
Sounds great.

Thanks ray - I'll see what's to be done with the "a"s...

It's not a problem - we don't live in each other's pockets and she knows I'm happiest when allowed to do what I want to do - plus there was nothing on that day, anyway...

[rayc]

..It's not a problem - we don't live in each other's pockets and she knows I'm happiest when allowed to do what I want to do - plus there was nothing on that day, anyway...

Yeah,
I've sussed that you are a very healthy couple.

[vomitHatSteve]

I'll echo that the lead vox are a little buried. It's not that bad, but it's noticeable compared to a lot of your other work.

The new guitar tone is a cool shift.

Short song for you. What gives??

I bought a Tele and it's sort of sent me in changed direction.

You'll be a snarling punk rocker before you even know it!

[Bubba]

The balances are now much better, vocals are at the right level. I do think the highs on the vocals are a bit dulled, though. And I'd still like the drums to be a tad louder, but it's much improved.

The guitars sit much better in the full mix now, but to me the eq tweaks have left the intro guitar sound a bit boxy. It's lost something that the original had - warmth, I think. Could we have the intro sound back and automate the Eq for the main part of the song? Or put the intro on its own track with the original eq? I know the compression is a feature of the guitar sound but I find it a bit too noticeable. A taste thing?

It's still 1 April there isn't it?

Tomorrow night...

LOL, feel free to ignore any or all of my nitpicking. It's a great song.

[Armistice]

LOL, feel free to ignore any or all of my nitpicking. It's a great song.

I always take your sonic observations very seriously and have just done a bunch of tweaks, hopefully along those lines...

And I was looking at the automation options in Reaper wondering how to turn a single band of the EQ on/off at a point in time, and not seeing it, and then I looked a bit more, and then "Oh yeah, just put the gain at zero" came to me... Been a long day.

[SweetDan]