New Song - The Unyielding March of Progress

[JD01]

Something that I've been working on during this Furlough period. This is the one that some of you have heard that I'm adding piano too.
No vocals yet - I've no idea how I'm going to sing this as I imagine it.

Unyielding - Mix 1.mp3

[SweetDan]

Sounds good so far. As noted in the previous thread, the piano part doesn't sit quite right, but the sound it needs may depend on what role the piano should play in the tune overall. There are a few lead-ish guitar parts (2:06, 4:41) that could stand to come out more as well. All that should be tempered with the effect the vocal (do you have words yet?) has on the mix, since you won't want those solo-y bits to overpower the future vocal.

[Armistice]

Epic! And over 6 minutes long... there's a prog rocker in you there somewhere...

It all sounds good to date - bar the piano, which is a bit lost at the moment. It's all going to change when you get some vocals in there anyway.

I missed your specific thread on this but (a) what's the piano? (b) does it have different sound modues? (c) assuming you played it old school, did you generate the MIDI file for it?

I've only used piano extensively in one tune recently - Choose Your Weapons. The URL below should take you to the spot but if not it's about 3.30 - so it's pretty clear, even when guitars and drums come crashing in - but that took a bit of experimentation with piano types.

https://youtu.be/1cJvWr7tRkg?list=OLAK5 ... RilM&t=213

If you have the MIDI and don't have a good array of piano sounds to choose from, I'm happy to run it through the various models on Pianoteq for you and give you some options - as you'll see below I've used a jazz piano, rather than a classical in CYW, and just rolled the bottom off via a HPF. Other pianos I tried just didn't work, so maybe it's as simple as changing piano types to get more cut through?

There were a couple of free VSTI pianos when I last checked about 3 years ago, which is why I shelled out for Pianoteq - they were all a bit crap.

Piano.png

When you've had a look at this, I'll edit the pic out of this post - don't want to gum up your thread...

[rayc]

It was a bit of a s hock to hear non high gain guitars in this. i like the cleanish rhythm guitars.
The leads sound pretty good.
I like the current piano tone as it stands apart like an intruder or an attempt to moderate.
Bass sounds fine with proggy growl - I assume that's the intention.
The kick drum doesn't work for my tastes but that's a personal thing.
Dark stuff James.

[JD01]

Epic! And over 6 minutes long... there's a prog rocker in you there somewhere...

It all sounds good to date - bar the piano, which is a bit lost at the moment. It's all going to change when you get some vocals in there anyway.

I missed your specific thread on this but (a) what's the piano? (b) does it have different sound modues? (c) assuming you played it old school, did you generate the MIDI file for it?

I've only used piano extensively in one tune recently - Choose Your Weapons. The URL below should take you to the spot but if not it's about 3.30 - so it's pretty clear, even when guitars and drums come crashing in - but that took a bit of experimentation with piano types.

https://youtu.be/1cJvWr7tRkg?list=OLAK5 ... RilM&t=213

If you have the MIDI and don't have a good array of piano sounds to choose from, I'm happy to run it through the various models on Pianoteq for you and give you some options - as you'll see below I've used a jazz piano, rather than a classical in CYW, and just rolled the bottom off via a HPF. Other pianos I tried just didn't work, so maybe it's as simple as changing piano types to get more cut through?

There were a couple of free VSTI pianos when I last checked about 3 years ago, which is why I shelled out for Pianoteq - they were all a bit crap.

Piano.png

When you've had a look at this, I'll edit the pic out of this post - don't want to gum up your thread...

Cheers Armi, I'll take a look at this later this morning.
I didn't do MIDI on the piano, but it's no problem to just do it again and take a midi of it.

I know the bit you mean in Choose Your Weapons.

Re: prog... there's so odd timings and chords buried in there!

[JD01]

It was a bit of a s hock to hear non high gain guitars in this. i like the cleanish rhythm guitars.
The leads sound pretty good.
I like the current piano tone as it stands apart like an intruder or an attempt to moderate.
Bass sounds fine with proggy growl - I assume that's the intention.
The kick drum doesn't work for my tastes but that's a personal thing.
Dark stuff James.

Cheers Ray. I think the crunch rhythms were might favourite bit too. I ended up quad tracking the heavy guitars. I'll have a look at the kick to see if anything is bothering me about it that I might want to change.

[Bubba]

I can't really comment on the music and mixing JD - it's so far out of my wheelhouse that it's not even funny! It seems to be working ok for you, though. As for the piano, the song really needs something with bite in order to fit, I think.

[JD01]

Sounds good so far. As noted in the previous thread, the piano part doesn't sit quite right, but the sound it needs may depend on what role the piano should play in the tune overall. There are a few lead-ish guitar parts (2:06, 4:41) that could stand to come out more as well. All that should be tempered with the effect the vocal (do you have words yet?) has on the mix, since you won't want those solo-y bits to overpower the future vocal.

Cheers, Dan. I think the lead parts you're talking about are more background/texture. There's no solos in this.

Yeah, i have plenty of lyrical/melodic ideas, not sure how I'm going to deal with it yet.

[JD01]

I can't really comment on the music and mixing JD - it's so far out of my wheelhouse that it's not even funny! It seems to be working ok for you, though. As for the piano, the song really needs something with bite in order to fit, I think.

Cheers, Bob.

[JD01]

[mention]Armistice[/mention] do you know how I send you my MIDI info?

If you could run it through various piano sims that would be great...

[vomitHatSteve]

Sounds good.

I like the change-ups with acoustic and piano. Depending on what the vocals are doing, the piano could work where it is. Tho it does seem a little narrow right now.

I'd volunteer to help with vox, but sadly my studio is in disarray.

[WhiskeyJack]

right away i hear something out of pitch. Possibly the bass? See between 0:08 to 0:11 and 0:27-00:37 and that bass soloy bridge part. Few other spots as well. My guess is you are playing a dropped tuning and things aren't as tight and snug as they should be? Or the intonation on your bass might be out as it only seems to be happening as you move up the neck to higher notes. All your low heavy ones sound tip top tidy and tight. maybe? I can't unhear it man. Sorry.

That acoustic sounds killer. The piano playing sounds awesome JD. Kudos to learning something new and running with it man. I'd be curious to hear that bit run through different Piano sounds and see if it springs out a bit more.

[JD01]

right away i hear something out of pitch. Possibly the bass? See between 0:08 to 0:11 and 0:27-00:37 and that bass soloy bridge part. Few other spots as well. My guess is you are playing a dropped tuning and things aren't as tight and snug as they should be? Or the intonation on your bass might be out as it only seems to be happening as you move up the neck to higher notes. All your low heavy ones sound tip top tidy and tight. maybe? I can't unhear it man. Sorry.

That acoustic sounds killer. The piano playing sounds awesome JD. Kudos to learning something new and running with it man. I'd be curious to hear that bit run through different Piano sounds and see if it springs out a bit more.

Good spot Shan, while my bass intonation could well be a bit out and its downtuned, what you're actually picking up in the two spots you mention is a flub in my playing! I'll have to re-record that.

I love the sound of this acoustic guitar.

[JD01]

Sounds good.

I like the change-ups with acoustic and piano. Depending on what the vocals are doing, the piano could work where it is. Tho it does seem a little narrow right now.

I'd volunteer to help with vox, but sadly my studio is in disarray.

No rush, Steve. Would be an honor to have you sing on something. I think I have another 5 or 6, possibly 8 songs to write on this project!

I wasn't planning on any vocals over the mellow interlude.

[Armistice]

@Armistice do you know how I send you my MIDI info?

If you could run it through various piano sims that would be great...

Just email me the file. I'll PM you my address...

[WhiskeyJack]

right away i hear something out of pitch. Possibly the bass? See between 0:08 to 0:11 and 0:27-00:37 and that bass soloy bridge part. Few other spots as well. My guess is you are playing a dropped tuning and things aren't as tight and snug as they should be? Or the intonation on your bass might be out as it only seems to be happening as you move up the neck to higher notes. All your low heavy ones sound tip top tidy and tight. maybe? I can't unhear it man. Sorry.

That acoustic sounds killer. The piano playing sounds awesome JD. Kudos to learning something new and running with it man. I'd be curious to hear that bit run through different Piano sounds and see if it springs out a bit more.

Good spot Shan, while my bass intonation could well be a bit out and its downtuned, what you're actually picking up in the two spots you mention is a flub in my playing! I'll have to re-record that.

I love the sound of this acoustic guitar.

What flavor of Acoustic do you have? IS it mic'd or di'd or a smattering of both. You did a really great job. I am currently fighting with my acoustic again for a good mic sound. If you felt like sharing fill me in.

If you are going to retrack to fix flubs maybe look into the intonation a bit too. I know they say it is generally best to address with new strings but for a bass i think it can be overlooked and just simply looked into and corrected.

Might be a great question for [mention]muttley[/mention]

Mutt, if a bass guitar is typically tuned to standard E and in a pretty impeccable state of intonation, could dropping the tuning affect the intonation at all?

[JD01]

Good spot Shan, while my bass intonation could well be a bit out and its downtuned, what you're actually picking up in the two spots you mention is a flub in my playing! I'll have to re-record that.

I love the sound of this acoustic guitar.

What flavor of Acoustic do you have? IS it mic'd or di'd or a smattering of both. You did a really great job. I am currently fighting with my acoustic again for a good mic sound. If you felt like sharing fill me in.

If you are going to retrack to fix flubs maybe look into the intonation a bit too. I know they say it is generally best to address with new strings but for a bass i think it can be overlooked and just simply looked into and corrected.

Might be a great question for @muttley

Mutt, if a bass guitar is typically tuned to standard E and in a pretty impeccable state of intonation, could dropping the tuning affect the intonation at all?

Yeah - its just a good acoustic in front of a mic, no other bollocks. Slight hi-pass and compression in the mix.

[Greg_L]

Fucking hell, 6 minutes!

Lots going on, pretty ambitious. Pretty proggy modern rock. I don't even wanna know how many thousands of tracks this must be. Sounds about right though. Well done.

[JD01]

Fucking hell, 6 minutes!

Lots going on, pretty ambitious. Pretty proggy modern rock. I don't even wanna know how many thousands of tracks this must be. Sounds about right though. Well done.

Haha, it's not that many!
Heavy rhythm guitars are two tracks each side.
Crunches are just one each side.
Interlude is just one each side.
There's very little lead guitar in this.

EDIT, oh there's two basses on this and a piano track... so yeah, I guess it's a bit of a soup.

[Bubba]

Fucking hell, 6 minutes!

Lots going on, pretty ambitious. Pretty proggy modern rock. I don't even wanna know how many thousands of tracks this must be. Sounds about right though. Well done.

Haha, it's not that many!
Heavy rhythm guitars are two tracks each side.
Crunches are just one each side.
Interlude is just one each side.
There's very little lead guitar in this.

EDIT, oh there's two basses on this and a piano track... so yeah, I guess it's a bit of a soup.

I told you it was all right.