Which of these mastered versions do you prefer?

[ido1957]

Would you guys have a listen to each of these versions and let me know which you prefer?
The only difference is the level of the vocals - one is 1db + than the other.
I'm leaning towards the +1 version.

In the past a lot of people mentioned that my mastered songs were too low for vocals. That was my fault as I chose the lower vocal mixes. I don't want that to happen this time, and outside ears would be greatly appreciated to help me make the right/best choice. It's all subjective but that's what I'm looking for lol...

Just some info if you're interested... This is stem mastered, using bus outputs for stems. So it has all my plugins, compressors, reverbs, delays etc etc on it from the all the tracks and busses.

Edit - here's the final:

[Greg_L]

I prefer the first option with the vocals sitting in the mix more.

[ido1957]

Thanks Greg! Appreciate the feedback.
Screwed up the title lol need more coffee

[Greg_L]

Thanks Greg! Appreciate the feedback.
Screwed up the title lol need more coffee

The louder vocal version is probably better for the style though. I think the kind of audience that would like your music listens to vocals and lyrics first, so the louder vocal version is probably better for that. Just for me, I like the more balanced mix.

[vomitHatSteve]

I think I prefer the first mix. There's just a few spots where the louder vocals really sit above the mix.

[ido1957]

The louder vocal version is probably better for the style though. I think the kind of audience that would like your music listens to vocals and lyrics first, so the louder vocal version is probably better for that. Just for me, I like the more balanced mix.

Good point - I ain't no virtuoso lol...

I think I prefer the first mix. There's just a few spots where the louder vocals really sit above the mix.

Thanks VHS - the ME said to let him know if anything needs adjusting so that's something I can ask him to look at.

[miroslav]

I think you can go with either and not lose any sleep over it.
Maybe a "composite of the two"...IOW...first version level for the verses, and second version level for the chorus.

I also use to pull the vocals back in the past, and make them just another element in the mix...that's how I was hearing it...but that's not how the pro's will generally choose to mix, because in most cases, it really is about the vocals, so they always push them up, especially these days.
So now I'm mixing the vocals up more than in the past...but then, I'll also do another "vocal up" mix just to have it....and I've even done a third mix where I pull them back, like I use to in the past.
In the end, I usually prefer that middle version, because that was the real target during the whole mixing process...and the vocal up/down mixes are just "safety" mixes.

[ido1957]

I think you can go with either and not lose any sleep over it.
Maybe a "composite of the two"...IOW...first version level for the verses, and second version level for the chorus.

I also use to pull the vocals back in the past, and make them just another element in the mix...that's how I was hearing it...but that's not how the pro's will generally choose to mix, because in most cases, it really is about the vocals, so they always push them up, especially these days.
So now I'm mixing the vocals up more than in the past...but then, I'll also do another "vocal up" mix just to have it....and I've even done a third mix where I pull them back, like I use to in the past.
In the end, I usually prefer that middle version, because that was the real target during the whole mixing process...and the vocal up/down mixes are just "safety" mixes.

Agreed - most of my fans (sister/brother lol ) are vocal centric and that's where I learned my lesson (too late) from my last venture.

[miroslav]

For me...it's now almost a necessity to do 2-3 mix versions because even though I'm playing back the tracks from my DAW, and I do a lot of stuff ITB....it's still coming out through my console, and I'm also doing a bunch of stuff OTB...so I don't want to be recalling that hybrid mix setup later on just because I realized the vocals were too loud or too soft.
Yeah...I take note of my console/OTB settings, and I still do the camera thing, taking pictures of the OTB gear/settings...but it's still a lot of work to recall all that, and I would rather not have to for something minor.
Same reason I take longer with the final mixing...and will leave the console and OTB gear set for days at a time, while I decide if I want to make changes...just so I don't end up having to reset everything a few days later when I realize something wasn't right.
So I take more time...but when I'm done with it, I don't revisit it again over and over and over...so I won't post endless remixes over a 3 year period.

[ido1957]

Final master is up in the OP. The others are gonzo.
I went with the first version with the vocals in the mix (without the +1).
Good idea

[rayc]

Sorry Gerry, I missed the options - I didn't notice anything in the listen section on Thurs. Fri or Sat. I must've been preoccupied.
I really like the level in the mix at the link (final). The vocal is clear, the lyrics are clear and the levels of the vocal suits the more rock feel.
Class act.

[ido1957]

Thanks Ray - no to worry, the first masters were not as good so you never missed anything lol....
My sister asked me if I could make the vocals on all the songs on my last 3 CD's the same as this one.
Now that would be a big task....so maybe not

[einstein magoo]

This turned out really well Ido.

[ido1957]

This turned out really well Ido.

It's good to hear that this sounds ok on your system. Add one more to another system check

[rammer24]

I missed the comparisons, but this sounds good. I actually find the vocals pretty loud, so I hope this is the "louder vocals" mix. Doesn't matter. Sounds good.

[ido1957]

Thanks Rami - my mic tends to be very forward sounding, at least that's how I would describe it. My previous mics (NTK/Sputnik) would sink into the mix quite well but not this one.

I've been playing around with various eq settings and reverbs (Lexicon PCM) and it takes hours to learn a) what all the sliders do b) what reverb pushes it back without sounding like a tunnel. My schedule is pretty intense at times, wish I could devote more time for learning, although my kid's all grown up so I shouldn't complain lol.

It was really nice to be able to send him my bus outputs (i.e. plugins/eq/levels) Although there are big improvements in clarity and smoothness (eq/compression on master whatever) I still hear what I mixed, it just sounds better. For my previous masters, a lot of it was dry stems and he pretty much applied his sound to it. Sounded good of course, but I didn't have the skills to even get close. I'm still just ok but this experience was good for the ego.

[rayc]

Gerry is Jan still mastering for you? Is this a stem jobbie?

[ido1957]

Gerry is Jan still mastering for you? Is this a stem jobbie?

Hi Ray - yes, it was a stem mastering but more me on this one. If you scroll up there's a few more details re the stems in one of my posts.

[ido1957]

I missed the comparisons, but this sounds good. I actually find the vocals pretty loud, so I hope this is the "louder vocals" mix. Doesn't matter. Sounds good.

I may have actually gotten the +1 vocal version. I'm going to check and see. I looked through some of my emails to Jan and I may have asked for that without realizing it. If yes, I'll get a 0 version and post it.

[WhiskeyJack]

I missed the comparison but the version i am hearing right now sounds pretty awesome. I love the vocal mix and where it sits. It's on it's own but glued in there. Great job Ido. Sorry i fell short on the decision making process.

2nd listen. Mix Balances nicely all around start to finish. I like it. Sticking it on my phone for future car drives.

3rd listen, My wife says "sounds like Gordon Lightfoot if Gordon Lightfoot was cool " and aslo Ido, the crashes at the very end of the song are still doing that thing i heard last time. Like cutting off instantly like it's gated weird or something ? was that Intentional?