Kemper

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Armistice
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Kemper

Post by Armistice »

OK - my guilty secret is out. In a quest to get decent sounds at apartment volume, I bought a Kemper. I've had it over a year now and have mainly been using it for low gain to crunchy sounds as that's where I'm most comfortable at knowing what a decent sound is, but I have this riff thing I've been meaning to turn into a song, and it needs more gain.

Now, as you're all probably aware, the Kemper isn't a sim as such, it profiles actual amps by feeding some noise into it and recording the output via a (whichever you choose) mic and back into the machine and voila! you have a profile. I haven't done this yet, nor am I going to. The big attraction is all these tone obsessives out there who generate profiles and put them up in the profiling area and you can just grab them.

Now the thing is, if can't dial your amp in with your guitar, and know where to put which mic, you're not going to get a good profile, and trust me, there are some rubbish ones out there - but there are also some really good ones, and some people also sell the damn things, although I haven't gone down this path. They're also set for specific pickups - a SC profile probably won't sound good with humbuckers and vice versa.

The problem is you have too much choice, so you have to quickly find some profiles you like and just use them, or you can sit there auditioning all day.

Anyway, without further ado, here are four takes of this riffy thing I hope to make into a song one day with four different profiles. I've got bass and simple canned drums in there too and have double tracked each at 70% L and R. I've made a slight EQ adjustment on the profiler between L and R just for the hell of it. Guitar is my new LP Standard, treble pickup. I've done nothing to the tracks in the DAW and have removed any included reverb etc. from the profiles.

Fuchs OD30

Marshall TSL

Cornford MK50

Marshall JCM800

I've just listed the amp type in the link. Each profile (usually) has details of the cab and mic used as well, but I won't bore you with them at the moment. Forgive the scrappy playing - I've found an input monitoring latency issue I haven't worked out yet and it was throwing me off a bit, especially in the second bit. I've just faded in and out a longer section to save you getting too bored listening to the whole thing over and over.

:metal: :metal: :metal: :metal: :metal: :jam: :jam: :biggrin:
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Minerman
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Re: Kemper

Post by Minerman »

Kudos to ya dude...You've worked all your life & you deserve whatever it is that makes ya happy... :coolstorybro:

I've been really curious about the Kemper (& the Axe FX), but the price tag is just too much for me...But, it kinda "evens itself out" if you factor all the gear it takes on the amp/cab/mic side compared to the Kemper/Axe FX IMO though...

I can definitely hear the difference in each clip, & my pick out of these is the JCM800 being the Marshall fanboy I've always been...

I'd add just a hair more high end to these tones if it were me, but that's just being picky...

Congrats dude, you've spent some serious coin on gear lately, hope you're enjoying yourself!!! :minernuggs:
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Lt. Bob
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Re: Kemper

Post by Lt. Bob »

yeah, I'd like more highs too.
For me the 800 sounded best and they all sound good .... just a little dark.
I'm eyeing those Kempers ..... but I'm also eyeing the Fractal so I'm not sure which will call to me more.
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Armistice
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Re: Kemper

Post by Armistice »

Lt. Bob wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2017 1:20 am yeah, I'd like more highs too.
For me the 800 sounded best and they all sound good .... just a little dark.
I'm eyeing those Kempers ..... but I'm also eyeing the Fractal so I'm not sure which will call to me more.
I like the TSL least, I vary on the others, and yes, they are all a bit dark, in hindsight, but it was 9am on Saturday morning - I was barely awake! Useful feedback anyway.

One thing that surprised me about the Kemper was how plasticky it is. While it's a proper rack unit (if you get the rack version like I did - although there are good reasons to get the toaster version for live instead), all the knobs are really lightweight plastic. A problem just waiting to happen if you're using it as a live thing... it's very light though! :biggrin:
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Re: Kemper

Post by Greg_L »

I'm gonna check this out in the AM. Well, morning in in the USA, which is like, I don't know, next Christmas for you Aussies?
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JD01
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Re: Kemper

Post by JD01 »

Thanks for posting these, mate. I think I've been looking forward to them for about 6 months now!

I though they were all pretty similar but the 800 was my favourite - the others just seemed to have touch of fizz on them. A touch dark but they're still good tones.

Curious you should post this today, one of the Andertons guys has just posted "top 5 Kemper profiles"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BY7tYUn445E
I know you watch them though so you've probably already spotted this.

Still ummming/ahhing about where to go next do I get a decent 2x12, get a good load-box/cab sim like a 2Notes Torpedo or just wait a while longer and get a Kemper.

If you're doing kemper requests, I'd like to hear you doing some medium gain punky palm mutes followed by some big chords.

EDIT: Armistice - just got around to watching that video (thought I'd better, seeing as I was posting it) there are some right good "Armistice Tones" on there. Particularly the Dumble and the Matchless
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Re: Kemper

Post by Greg_L »

Hmm, well I agree with the others - very dark. All of them. Listening through the darkness, I'm thinking the Fuchs and 800 profiles sound probably the best.

One thing I can tell you for sure - a JCM 800 is NEVER that dark. Not even with the treble and presence rolled all the way off and the bright cap snipped out. So, maybe find a different JCM 800 profile and try again if you ever want *that* sound.

It's interesting though. Is this recorded direct? Do you get to choose your cab modeling or anything? Or are the profiles just what they are? Can you tweak them?
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Armistice
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Re: Kemper

Post by Armistice »

Greg_L wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:42 am Hmm, well I agree with the others - very dark. All of them. Listening through the darkness, I'm thinking the Fuchs and 800 profiles sound probably the best.

One thing I can tell you for sure - a JCM 800 is NEVER that dark. Not even with the treble and presence rolled all the way off and the bright cap snipped out. So, maybe find a different JCM 800 profile and try again if you ever want *that* sound.

It's interesting though. Is this recorded direct? Do you get to choose your cab modeling or anything? Or are the profiles just what they are? Can you tweak them?
I'm not near the machine for the next day and a half so I can't really give you detailed answers. It's recorded guitar -> Kemper -> Interface -> DAW with the Kemper to Interface link via SPDIF. I've not really dug into the cabinets section much yet, but pretty much anything is tweakable.

The 800 profile comes from Ace of Skunk Anansie, who's also a Marshall-endorsed artist, as part of a pack of profiles he did for Kemper which Kemper themselves distributed (for free) - so there's a good chance that the profile itself is good. Here are the cab and mic details he used. What I don't know is what guitar it's set up for, and what he routinely uses.

Marshall JCM 800 handwired and selected - Zilla Fat Boy 2*12 w/ Celestion Vintage 30 - Shure SM57

So I guess it's like anything else in the wonderful world of guitar/amp interactions - you have to tweak to get the sound you want. So far on the lower gain levels I seem usually to be rolling off bass and adding in treble - these I left pretty flat, but there's lots of scope for tweaking.

Find me a good 800 reference tone and I'll see if I can get closer - that's my problem - not having the amp, I'm not really sure what it "should' sound like.

And that's the other can of worms - the question of "does it sound like what the profiled amp is supposed to sound like?" is useful, but ultimately, "Does it sound good?" is what we aim for. But sounds like it needs some tweaking to do yet. :biggrin:
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Re: Kemper

Post by Armistice »

JD01 wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2017 5:51 am Thanks for posting these, mate. I think I've been looking forward to them for about 6 months now!

I though they were all pretty similar but the 800 was my favourite - the others just seemed to have touch of fizz on them. A touch dark but they're still good tones.

Curious you should post this today, one of the Andertons guys has just posted "top 5 Kemper profiles"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BY7tYUn445E
I know you watch them though so you've probably already spotted this.

Still ummming/ahhing about where to go next do I get a decent 2x12, get a good load-box/cab sim like a 2Notes Torpedo or just wait a while longer and get a Kemper.

If you're doing kemper requests, I'd like to hear you doing some medium gain punky palm mutes followed by some big chords.

EDIT: Armistice - just got around to watching that video (thought I'd better, seeing as I was posting it) there are some right good "Armistice Tones" on there. Particularly the Dumble and the Matchless
I haven't seen that vid JD, thanks for that, I'll have a watch.

And apologies for the tardiness, I actually have a JDOD file on my PC where I started doing this but then I realised I didn't know what sound you wanted to hear, as I don't really play punky stuff. So why don't you give me a reference tune that I can work out easily enough and I'll learn it and have a dig through during the week and see what I can find.

I'm sure I can do palm mutes and open chords however, but as I said to Greg, I'm not anywhere near a guitar for a couple of days, so bear with me for a bit longer.
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Re: Kemper

Post by Greg_L »

Armistice wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2017 5:57 pm


Find me a good 800 reference tone and I'll see if I can get closer - that's my problem - not having the amp, I'm not really sure what it "should' sound like.
Well, not to pimp my own shit, but here's a little clip of my JCM 800 I did a while back. I'm not saying my 800 tone is the end all be all, but this clip is an actual JCM 800 2203 through Vintage 30s, like your profile, and it's pretty typical of what a JCM 800 sounds like set pretty roaring. And I did it with a Les Paul and a 57, so gear-wise it pretty much matches what you're trying to do.

JCM 800

* Never mind the cleanish beginning. The vol was rolled back on the guitar.
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Re: Kemper

Post by Armistice »

Greg_L wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2017 6:18 pm
Armistice wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2017 5:57 pm


Find me a good 800 reference tone and I'll see if I can get closer - that's my problem - not having the amp, I'm not really sure what it "should' sound like.
Well, not to pimp my own shit, but here's a little clip of my JCM 800 I did a while back. I'm not saying my 800 tone is the end all be all, but this clip is an actual JCM 800 2203 through Vintage 30s, like your profile, and it's pretty typical of what a JCM 800 sounds like set pretty roaring. And I did it with a Les Paul and a 57, so gear-wise it pretty much matches what you're trying to do.

JCM 800

* Never mind the cleanish beginning. The vol was rolled back on the guitar.
This is actually exactly what I want Greg - an actual recording so I can see what tweaking needs to be done, or can be done. I won't listen now, I'll wait until I'm back home near the machine. Excellent! :biggrin:
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Re: Kemper

Post by Greg_L »

Armistice wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2017 6:24 pm

This is actually exactly what I want Greg - an actual recording so I can see what tweaking needs to be done, or can be done. I won't listen now, I'll wait until I'm back home near the machine. Excellent! :biggrin:
Cool man, there ya go. Real life reference tone. Good luck with it. :coolstorybro:
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Re: Kemper

Post by JD01 »

Armistice wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2017 6:01 pm
JD01 wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2017 5:51 am Thanks for posting these, mate. I think I've been looking forward to them for about 6 months now!

I though they were all pretty similar but the 800 was my favourite - the others just seemed to have touch of fizz on them. A touch dark but they're still good tones.

Curious you should post this today, one of the Andertons guys has just posted "top 5 Kemper profiles"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BY7tYUn445E
I know you watch them though so you've probably already spotted this.

Still ummming/ahhing about where to go next do I get a decent 2x12, get a good load-box/cab sim like a 2Notes Torpedo or just wait a while longer and get a Kemper.

If you're doing kemper requests, I'd like to hear you doing some medium gain punky palm mutes followed by some big chords.

EDIT: Armistice - just got around to watching that video (thought I'd better, seeing as I was posting it) there are some right good "Armistice Tones" on there. Particularly the Dumble and the Matchless
I haven't seen that vid JD, thanks for that, I'll have a watch.

And apologies for the tardiness, I actually have a JDOD file on my PC where I started doing this but then I realised I didn't know what sound you wanted to hear, as I don't really play punky stuff. So why don't you give me a reference tune that I can work out easily enough and I'll learn it and have a dig through during the week and see what I can find.

I'm sure I can do palm mutes and open chords however, but as I said to Greg, I'm not anywhere near a guitar for a couple of days, so bear with me for a bit longer.
Yeah, mate just do something in my kind of style. Pretty much everything I've heard from kemper has been really impressive though.

The vid is probably massively demoralising. Rabea, could make a bean tin sound good.
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Armistice
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Re: Kemper

Post by Armistice »

JD01 wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2017 6:36 pm
Yeah, mate just do something in my kind of style. Pretty much everything I've heard from kemper has been really impressive though.

The vid is probably massively demoralising. Rabea, could make a bean tin sound good.
He's not bad is he? He also comes across as a genuinely nice bloke.
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Re: Kemper

Post by Minerman »

You guys beat me to it, I was gonna suggest using one of Greg's 800 clips for reference... :minernuggs:

I'm really curious to how close the Kemper can get to the real deal...I'm pretty much all-in with my amp/cabs/mics, but you never know, I might eventually go back to the modeling side...maybe... :biggrin:
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Re: Kemper

Post by Greg_L »

Hey armistice, where you at with this?
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Armistice
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Re: Kemper

Post by Armistice »

Greg_L wrote: Tue Feb 28, 2017 8:20 am Hey armistice, where you at with this?
LOL - nowhere just now. I'll fire it all up tomorrow night again but I have so little time to play at the moment that I'll probably concentrate on the new song I'm doing. Will see if I can do some chunka chunka stuff for JD as well.
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Re: Kemper

Post by miroslav »

The Kemper is certainly a nice studio tool. I've listened to a few amp vs Kemper shootouts...and for sure, it gets about 90% of the way for most anything it models.

That said...my own mentality with guitar amps has gone 100% old-school....not that I think traditional, P-to-P wired, tuba amps are some holy grail....it's just what I prefer.

For instance....I've been considering getting a custom build from Carol Ann amps. I love the one I have, but there's another model that has a different flavor, and it's killer on Blues/Rock tones. So anyway, the build would not be cheap (which is why I haven't pulled the trigger yet)...and all the new stuff being built from Carol Ann now comes with a proprietary auto-biasing circuit. It's very cool and unique...and basically, it allows you to readjust the bias with a push of a button, so no matter where you are, whatever the voltage, whatever the age of the tubes...you can easily/quickly re-bias the amp.
Also, the circuit allows you to run a variety of power tube types, and again, quickly/easily re-bias the amp...and finally, the circuit acts as protection against a blown tube or other issues...it will basically save the amp from anything catastrophic.
Now you would think all that is a plus/plus/plus...but TBH, I'm just not in love with the idea of adding this very modern/processor controlled circuit...to a tube amp, and if/when I do the custom build...I'm considering asking him no to included that circuit, but just build it old-school.

Go figure...but that's just my own attitude about guitar amps. :P

Anyway...good luck with the Kemper...I'm sure it will be a lot of fun. :coolstorybro:
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